As noted, we're releasing DSL-3.0.1

Forum: Site News
Topic: As noted, we're releasing DSL-3.0.1
started by: John

Posted by John on June 22 2006,08:12

The only difference with this release and < 3.0 > is that unionfs is an option, and not set by default. We are currently working on the incompatibility of our Firefox build with unionfs.

Posted by kerry on June 22 2006,08:26

I already have to use legacy, cause that unionfs just gives me to many problems on this machine. So i'm all set. Wow, that means i was up to date before you was.LOL

Posted by John on June 23 2006,17:24

Kerry, what problem were unionfs causing?

Posted by kerry on June 23 2006,17:52

Hey jhon, I couldn't figure out what the exact problem was. For some reason the problems seemed different from boot to boot. The one that was constant was if i use the /tmp for extentions everything would lock up. So i didn't use /tmp i used /opt instead. Other times i would have problems with mount a "to many files mounted message". I also found a problem with a file called tmp.ci(somthing with apt-get) that would just run on forever until the memory filled up and crash. So i just finally let it go and only booted with legacy, which never gave me any problems. Jhon, i'm sorry i can't be more exact on the problems or the cause, i spent day's trying to figure it out, once i realized there was a problem and started looking for the cause the system would slowly become unusable or just crash so i could never pin point the cause. I've used other distro's that have unionfs and only get problems with DSL's unionfs so i don't think it's my computer. I have DSL set up to run in QEMU on my Xubuntu install so i can try and figure out the problems, but have had no luck.Take care.

Posted by ZoOp on June 23 2006,22:04

John,

I also have had problems of unstablility with DSL-3.0 stable. I posted two of them today when trying to solve them, and I would report the results of my last try, when I see unfortunatly, that my two last posts were no more in the forum (I don't know why, because they were there a couple of hours before).

Anyway, I try to describe the problem again: when I install a unc extension at boot with DSL-3.0 stable frugal installed (I tried with samba, gtk2 and opera), DSL wants to write them to /opt, but it sees that they already exists and report an error; at startx though, the extension have been installed and seem to work perfectly. But after a short use of opera (f.ex. 2 hours), opera freeze and I have to reboot DSL. I spent a lot of time to figure out the problem, but I just don't know why these unc extensions give me this error message at boot.

The instability of firefox was also a problem for me followed by error messages at shut down concerning the opera and samba unc's extension (DSL says it can't unmount them). So, I decide to make a fresh frugal install of DSL 2.4. Everything works fine, since I want to load openoffice.uci; I'm going to emelfm and I am clicking on openoffice (as I usually do): nothing happens. Moreover, I didn't see any "mydsl" button in emelfm, which is normally there in this release, as if some properties of DSL-3.0 have been kept while installing 2.4.

I am telling me: it's my system. I make then a new partition of my hd with new formating and new install of DSL-3.0.1. Everything is fine, but the installation of unc same extensions, which gives me the same error message at boot. I'm back to the beginning and, sorry, but I'm not able to find out the cause.

yours
z

Posted by roberts on June 24 2006,00:35

ZoOp, most of your issues, I have already answered...

But again...

Running Opera for a couple of hours and then a problem.
SOP. Reduce your cache in any browser that you use. The default cache is way too large for a ram based system.

Directory already exists error on loading an extension is caused by an improper shutdown, see above for why! Or perhaps a persistent /opt ? I never could figure why a persistent /opt is helpful. Persistent /home yes. Try not using a persistent /opt The existing directory does no harm and has no effect on running the extension.

Error on unloading an unc. We don't support unloading an unc type extension. They are not self contained like a uci. The "operation not permitted" message was removed.

Posted by roberts on June 24 2006,00:36

Kerry, you had previously stated that your /tmp was mounted.
For proper operation it should be left in the ramdisk as per normal setup.

Posted by clivesay on June 24 2006,02:41

Quote (roberts @ June 23 2006,19:35)

I never could figure why a persistent /opt is helpful.

Hi, Robert.

Persistent /opt came about when everyone was using mainly .dsl and .tar.gz extensions. There was no way to run apps like openoffice.tar.gz or many tar.gz extensions on lower ram machines without having the tar.gz file uncompressed to a partition. Now that things are moving to .uci and .unc the persistent /opt may have run it's course as far as being a necessity.

Chris

Posted by kerry on June 24 2006,04:20

Quote (roberts @ June 23 2006,20:36)

Kerry, you had previously stated that your /tmp was mounted.
For proper operation it should be left in the ramdisk as per normal setup.

So it's not suppose to be mounted, right? I have tried to unmount it, but it won't unmount.

Posted by ZoOp on June 24 2006,08:09

"SOP. Reduce your cache in any browser that you use. The default cache is way too large for a ram based system."

Opera: I used it with dsl 2.4 without any problem, so that I am surprised that Opera has these problems now with 3.0/3.0.1. I tried also with reduced cache, with no avail. Anyway, I shall remain browsing with firefox.

"Directory already exists error on loading an extension is caused by an improper shutdown, see above for why!"

I don't shutdown my machine wrong, but I shutdown it normally with exit-->poweroff and wait until it is quiet.

"Or perhaps a persistent /opt ? I never could figure why a persistent /opt is helpful. Persistent /home yes. Try not using a persistent /opt The existing directory does no harm and has no effect on running the extension."

I did the same as Kerry, and got the same message. I don't think that I am using a persistent /opt because I don't make any change in the way DSL mount the directories. I install it frugal, write in the boot line toram and the appropriate setting for my language, and that's all.

"Error on unloading an unc. We don't support unloading an unc type extension. They are not self contained like a uci. The "operation not permitted" message was removed."

I know. I don't unload unc. I have written: when I shutdown dsl, I get the message "operation not permitted". But it's know ok, since you remove it.

Observation: I am sorry to write messages like this one, but it's in order to give you informations on what's going on when I use DSL on my machine without tweaks or any specific methods, but just as a "normal user". I read your answers carefully, and try to apply your advices in order to see what I am doing wrong. However, when I spend a week in order to figure out what I am doing wrong, and find always the same errors, I like to tell it to you. That is especially so when your advices do unfortunately not provide the expected solutions. It is a kind of "feedback" to the expert you are, Robert, and it should support the discussion on the project as well as the project itself.

yours
z

Posted by roberts on June 24 2006,15:00

Sorry if frustration is starting to show. But the fact of the matter is...

If /opt is on ramdisk, as is normally the case, then upon a reboot all directories that were created upon using any mountable type extensions could not possibly persist.
So I remain without anything that I can reproduce.

I daily use Opera852.unc and/or the new seamonkey gtk1 uci and have not experienced any issues with these browsers after I had reduced the cache size for my particular machine/environment. John and I are aware that the builin firefox does have issues.

After thinking about what Chris posted about reasons for persistent /opt makes wish to state the following:

1. frugal does not necessarily imply persistent anything.

2. for obvious reasons unionfs overlays does not make much sense with a traditional hard drive install.

3. Using persistent options together with frugal is kinda like a hybrid hard drive install.

4. unionfs overlays may very well not make sense with a hybrid install. This hybrid install was created, as Chris, stated as a way to install large apps and avoid the ramdisk.

5. hybrid installs defeats the nodmaic goal of DSL as it anchors one to a particular system, however, DSL does not dictate that that be such and allows users to configure as they so desire.

6. I standby when a reproducible issue is presented to try to resolve it just as is the case with any aspect of DSL.

7. v3.0.1 does not default to unionfs so you may wish to avoid unionfs all together or postpone embracing it until a later release, especially if it is causing you grief. Personally I use it exclusively and without issues. I would not have released it if such was not the case.

I am sorry if I offend anyone or come across as dismissive but without directly reproducible issues, I can only guess at how their systems might be configured or what might be causing their problem.

Posted by clivesay on June 24 2006,17:43

I agree with Robert about the hybrid installs. Persistent /home and /opt were provided so people could run some large apps on older machines or store large amounts of personal files but still enjoy the benefits of Frugal. In the 'olden days' having a persistent /opt allowed you to run the Openoffice.tar.gz extension on a 64, 96, 128mb ram machine with a frugal install. At the time, you could have your cake and eat it too. If people move to unionfs then I think a perisistent /opt is just asking for trouble. I haven't had time to try myself but I would love to hear ram usage comparisons from booting stock DSL and running DSL with UnionFS and multiple unc files on something like a 64mb ram machine.

Maybe getting off topic here a little. These are new features and will take awhile to either shake the bugs out or understand what the right combinations of options are to make everything on the system live in harmony.

Chris

Posted by kerry on June 24 2006,20:28

robert, you can let it all out, we'll understand. you still always be the man.

Posted by ZoOp on June 24 2006,21:08

Robert,
it's ok, thanks for your post.
Chris,
thanks for your post. A problem still remains with samba.unc, but I have to check my install again.

yours
z

Posted by vees on June 25 2006,01:19

Hi everybody,

These are the issues which I had with DSL 3.0:

At the end of the boot up process Dillo is launched with - I suppose as in the past - a short introduction to DSL. With DSL 3.0 however Dillo also starts but does not open any file. A message at the bottom of Dillo says that dpid could not be started. I tried starting it from the console and I got this:

AS DSL:

Quote

dpi_socket_dir.c:63: tst_dir: access : No such file or directory
- /tmp/dsl-r1b1bc/
debug_msg - init_sockdir: The socket directory /tmp/dsl-r1b1bc does not exist or is not a directory
dpi_socket_dir.c:85: mk_sockdir: a_Misc_mkdtemp : - /tmp/dsl-l8ctg8
dpi_socket_dir.c:123: init_sockdir: mk_sockdir : - Failed to create dpi socket directory
main.c:243: main: init_sockdir : Failed to create socket directory

AS ROOT:

Quote

dpi.c:61: a_Dpi_rd_dpi_socket_dir: access : No such file or directory
- /root/.dillo

Other problems I noticed included that the mount tool cannot be started and neither can the system stats.

I use DSL on a laptop and acpi is buggy. It does correctly report the precentage of battery charge, but tormso erroneously says "AC" when my laptop is running on its battery. When I run acpi from a terminal it does correctly report when the battery is charging, but it adds "charging at zero rate - will never fully charge".

Do you think that these problems are due to UNIONFS? I used DSL 2.x on the same computer without ever having any problems whatsoever; are there other differences between 2.4.and 3.0 which would explain my problems?

Kind regards & many thanks,

VS

Posted by kerry on June 25 2006,01:25

vees, i think you might have a bad burn. try down loadind and burning a new one. I'm using dillo 90% of the time and don't have any problems with it running. i just moved up to 3.0.1 yesterday and it's working just as good.->
< http://img145.imageshack.us/img145/4306/dillo8ko.png >

Posted by vees on June 25 2006,04:28

ok. I will try again and come back if the problem persists.

thanks,

VS

Posted by ZoOp on June 25 2006,07:53

Hi again,

I have one little issue with 3.0.1 (frugal installed): when I open mydslbrowser and hit the button "load local mydsl extension", the window opens systematically in a "UCIext" directory that I created for UCI extensions (at /mnt/hda5/). I tried to install 3.0.1 again, and I got the same issue.

And I would suggested to add a "UNC" button in the mydslbrowser.

yours
z

Posted by ZoOp on June 25 2006,14:43

Hi,
I solved the first problem after a new fresh install of DSL-3.0.1, so it was then my config.
yours
z

Posted by meo on June 27 2006,06:58

Hi everybody!

I use DSL 3.0.1 embedded even though I start it natively with a cdrom. My BIOS don't support a direct boot. In my experience it works just well even with unionfs (which saves a lot of ram). An odd thing I've discovered is that I hardly have any problems with the built in Firefox if I run Xmms at the same time. I can even update to gtk-2 with Xmms running and firefox keeps working. I also use Firefox 1.5.0.4 after updating and it works without a hinch. My uptime is now 1 day 10 hours and 8 minutes and it just keeps running.

Have fun out there,
meo

Posted by kuky on July 09 2006,11:27

hello to all ��

when i change of dsl ver 2.4 to 3.0.1 i notice that in a new installation to hard drive i have problems with the saved config of a wireless card (in ver 2.4 it is ok between starts) in ver 3.0.1 i have to add the insmod files of the wlan to opt/bottocal.sh and after make a ifconfig and iwconfig lines in aterm o net config of panel control..

if i use iwconfing (iwlan) of panel control to make myiwconfig.sh it is only with option managed ... ?

who is new in ver 3.0.1 ?

Posted by knix on July 11 2006,19:00

Hi,

I just discovered an issue with fluxbox configuration: If you deselect the option "Use Icons" via fluxbox menu "Desktop -> Configuration -> Use Icons", minimized windows do not show up in the task bar at the bottom of the screen, and it not self explaining how to open these windows again (left click on "Workspace X"-> Icons). Small cause, great effect!

First I assumed my processes were terminated after minimizing, but after some research I found the real cause in .fluxbox/init: Option "session.iconbar" must not be false.

If session.iconbar is false, only the active window is shown in the taskbar. If it is true, all minimized windows are shown.

Maybe somebody by chance stepped into the same trap.
Suggestion: Remove the selection "Use Icons" from DSL menu.

BTW: Anything works great, even with persistent opt (which I just removed after the posts from the last days).

knix

Posted by mikshaw on July 11 2006,19:16

This is not a bug, and it is not something that can be removed from the menu without changing the Fluxbox sourcecode (look at the fluxbox menu file and you'll see it is a part of the hard-coded "[config]" menu item).

This is a Fluxbox feature which toggles the use of iconified windows (not the desktop icons supplied by xtdesk). These iconified windows ARE the minimized windows, so the "Use Icons" toggle is doing precisely what it is meant to do.

If you want to disable desktop icons, you can do it with the icon tool, or change "icons: 1" to "icons: 0" in /home/dsl/.desktop

Maybe a suggestion could instead be changing the label "Configuration" to "Fluxbox Configuration".

Posted by knix on July 12 2006,10:42

Thank you for your answer. The term "icon" usually means "small pictures", obviously fluxbox uses its own terminology. But this is probably well documented. My problem that I did not yet read the fluxbox manual.
I agree with your suggestion.

Posted by mikshaw on July 12 2006,15:12

I can't be entirely sure about this, but i believe the terms "icon" and "iconified window" have been in use in several window managers for much longer than Fluxbox has been in existence. Some of these window managers actually create "small pictures" on the desktop when a window is minimized (iconified). Click the icon and your window is restored. Others, such as blackbox or fluxbox, simply create a text pointer to the iconified window, and they tuck that pointer away in a discreet, out-of-the-way place (middle-click) so it will not be a visual distraction.

This is just one of those times when terminology used in one popular system causes new users of a different system to expect same terms to mean the same thing. But if you consider the origins of the word, an icon is simply a placeholder or representation of something else. It could be an image, or it could be a text label, or it could be something entirely different.

Posted by andrewb on July 18 2006,01:34

The F3 boot screen needs updated for 3.0.1 to show unionfs is an option. It currently shows legacy is an option nthat has to be selected at boot time.

Posted by iconoclast on July 29 2006,15:48

Quote (mikshaw @ July 12 2006,11:12)

...But if you consider the origins of the word, an icon is simply a placeholder or representation of something else. It could be an image, or it could be a text label, or it could be something entirely different.

If you consider the origins of the word, late Latin icon, Greek eicon, meaning image or likeness...

Posted by mikshaw on July 29 2006,18:20

Well...the dictionary I have says "representation" =o)

Posted by newby on July 30 2006,11:09

Quote (ZoOp @ June 23 2006,18:04)

I too have had problems, programs locking and Icons vanishing (or partially vanishing). It may be related to my loading my-DSL extentions.

Sorry, I'm too much of a newby to be of any further help though.